LED basic questions

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bmaster31
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LED basic questions

Post by bmaster31 »

Hey guys, I'm getting ready to invest in Comet LED's for Goldeneye and I have a few questions that I can't find in my searches online.

1. Does non-ghosting requirements apply to bulbs used for GI lighting? - I ask because I wanted to go with 2 SMD bulbs, but I don't see any frosted non-ghosting bulbs on their site.

2. I've seen LED flashers that totally blind you, are those the 8 SMD flashers? I was thinking of going with the 5 SMD matrix bulbs, thoughts?

3. Looking under the play field it appears there are some GI mounts that cannot be unscrewed from underneath, am I missing something? or do I have to remove the ramps/plastics they are hiding under to replace them from above the playfield?

4. Am I ok going with the faceted bulb for the parallel mounted inserts? or should I go with the flex bulbs?

What are your thoughts on my light selections (all color matched, all Natrual White GI)?
Inserts (both perpendicular and parallel mounted) : 2 SMD faceted non-ghosting http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/2smd3528-ng.htm
GI/backglass (ghosting): 2 SMD frosted http://www.cometpinball.com/Comet-Pinba ... p/2led.htm
GI/backglass(non-ghosting): 1 SMD frosted http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/1smd5050ng.htm
Flashers: 5 SMD matrix http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/5smdflash.htm
Spot light: Optix Maximus Spot http://www.cometpinball.com/product-p/opmax-nr.htm

I'm sure I'll have more questions as the project moves forward.

Thanks!
Brandon
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Chris K
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Re: LED basic questions

Post by Chris K »

Prepare for lots of opinions! Lighting is totally a matter of taste.

You don't need non-ghosting for GI. In fact, Comet's NG bulbs tend to be thicker than the standard bulbs, which can cause problems fitting the bulb through the playfield on some tables. Save some cash and skip the NG.

2SMD is pretty bright to cover a table's GI. This is all a matter of taste, but you might also consider 1SMD or even 1LED. You might mix it up too; some areas need more light than others.

I prefer frosted domes for almost all applications. They give the most uniform throw IMHO. Faceted bulbs are non-uniform (which you may prefer in some locations), and bare bulbs are OK under inserts but are blinding if you're looking right at them. I've just standardized on frosted bulbs, generally.

LED flashers can indeed be blinding. I use 5-SMD towers normally (cause they fit nicely in place of standard flashers), and have only used 8-SMD flashers when I want something super bright. LED flashers are great behind/under plastics. It's when they're bare that they're annoying. You may want to stick with standard flashers for exposed bulbs.

I'm not sure what you mean by mounts that can't be unscrewed... are they bayonet mounts screwed into the playfield? Wedge bulbs on a PCB? Some bulbs are easier from top or bottom. I'd expect to remove most of the plastics if you're going to LED the table... I generally do mine from the top cause it gives me a good opportunity to clean the plastics.

I like flex bulbs for inserts. You can control the distance of the SMD, which lets you fill each insert up perfectly without spotlighting the insert (ie: a bright spot in the middle). You can also avoid a lot of bleed in closely-spaced inserts. Faceted or frosted bulbs are OK in a pinch, but if you're placing an order for a full table I suggest using flex for any insert bulb mounted sideways under the table.

For your backglass I think 1SMD is about as bright as you'd want. With 30+ bulbs, the backglass can get pretty overpowering. Buy a Bent Plastic to cut down on glare.

Pay close attention to which white you want when ordering. Some tables look good with warm white (near the incandescent color temp), and some look better with Natural or even Cool white. It depends on the table. I wouldn't suggest putting colors under plastics (like blue under a blue insert)... it won't be much more blue than a Natural White bulb, any non-blue colors will be washed out, and any light escaping will throw blue around the table.

On the other hand, I find insert bulbs can look really nice with color-matched bulbs. Darker colors (like purple) look particularly nice. I also like to use a cooler white temp in inserts than in the GI... it makes white inserts stand out.

Again, lighting is all up to taste, and you might find yourself changing your mind as you play around. I suggest buying a few extra bulbs in a variety of colors/types when you place your order so you can mess around with different setups. Expect to place another order afterwards and curse yourself for wasting $20 on bulbs you didn't use. That's OK, you can put them in the next table. :)
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bmaster31
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Re: LED basic questions

Post by bmaster31 »

Do you use flex bulbs for all your inserts? or just the sideways mounts?

As far as the mounts question, I believe they are screwed into the playfield from the top, just can't tell because they are buried under ramps and plastics.

Thanks for the input!
Brandon

P.S. I think my brother(s) and I are going to make the trip up to Alt Brew tomorrow to meet a few of you guys and see how bad we really are at pinball! :)
Hilton
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Re: LED basic questions

Post by Hilton »

bmaster31 wrote: Brandon

P.S. I think my brother(s) and I are going to make the trip up to Alt Brew tomorrow to meet a few of you guys and see how bad we really are at pinball! :)

If you come a little early then remind me and I can show you what I typically do for all games (comet frosted 2SMD warm whites)
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ralphwiggum
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Re: LED basic questions

Post by ralphwiggum »

bmaster31 wrote:Do you use flex bulbs for all your inserts? or just the sideways mounts?

As far as the mounts question, I believe they are screwed into the playfield from the top, just can't tell because they are buried under ramps and plastics.

Thanks for the input!
Brandon

P.S. I think my brother(s) and I are going to make the trip up to Alt Brew tomorrow to meet a few of you guys and see how bad we really are at pinball! :)

Unfortunately, Sega and Data East are the worst offenders when it comes to GI bulbs. They were super cheap and stapled the socket to the playfield from the bottom along with the braid. You pretty much have to get at them from the topside, where as the other manufactuers used a screw to hold in the socket for easy access from the bottom.

I would warn again using any SMD bulbs in backboxes that use thinner translites (most williams for sure). It really adds to the glare on the playfield glass even with a bent plastic in line to block dmd glare.

Again, all personal preference.
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Chris K
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Re: LED basic questions

Post by Chris K »

Try to check out the socket from under the table... it's probably a #44 bayonet socket, like this:

http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=992

I like to go at 'em from the top. Otherwise you have to bend or remove the socket.

I only use flex bulbs when I notice the non-flex ones don't light the insert nicely. Some inserts are great with standard bulbs and some are much better "filled" with flex bulbs. Usually the smaller arrows.

I suggest buying a a few small packs of other kinds of bulbs for testing different configurations. For example, if you're going with cool white GI, buy a small pack of warm white to see if you like that better. You might try to get a few clear, bare, and faceted too to see which kind of cap you like best.

$10 in extra bulbs will help you find the look you like best. Sometimes the bulb you think will be great looks awful when in the table.

LED'ing a table is fun! Give yourself some options to experiment!
Our pinball table breeding stock:
Star Trek: The Next Generation, Scared Stiff, Black Hole, Roy Clark, Monster Bash Remake, Future Spa, Big Deal, Top Score, Baywatch, Rick and Morty, TMNT, Sinbad, Guns N Roses
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